England 2 Sweden 2

[Otters]

Very true Dean,

Argentinas squad is frightening, the thought they could leave Messi on the bench wow

has it always been 2 yellows??

[Fingers]

I dont think you can read much into that game last night as they both rested all their players on yellow cards.

Which brings me onto my next subject, YELLOW CARDS. Bloody ridiculous that after 2 yellow cards you get a ban. Should be 3.

All that has happened is that us, the fans, have seen sides that are already through fielding weaker teams so that they do not get suspended. Just devalues the spectacle.

I totally agree especially the way referees hand out the cards nowadays. Two slightly mis-timed tackles and you miss a game. Stupid yellows for decent, kicking the ball away and diving is right, but then these again are down to the desgression of the referee. I think we should have a panel who analyses the cards given and recind those that are given unfairly by inadequate refs.

[Lord Zola]

The team picks itself now without Owen in my opinion...

-------------------Robinson---------------------------------
Carragher-----Ferdinand------------Terry------------Cole
Beckham----Gerrard----Hargreaves----Lampard----Cole
--------------------Rooney----------------------------------

I know we were pony 2nd half v Sweden but I feel we still have a great chance of making the Quarters and still fancy ourselves against Holland or Portugal now the Argies are out of danger.

ROLL ON SUNDAY

That's exactly the side I would pick Dean. Without question. Is there anyone not in side who could really argue they should be playing?? (Neville if fit, but he's not)

[Lord Zola]

The team picks itself now without Owen in my opinion...

-------------------Robinson---------------------------------
Carragher-----Ferdinand------------Terry------------Cole
Beckham----Gerrard----Hargreaves----Lampard----Cole
--------------------Rooney----------------------------------

I know we were pony 2nd half v Sweden but I feel we still have a great chance of making the Quarters and still fancy ourselves against Holland or Portugal now the Argies are out of danger.

ROLL ON SUNDAY

That's exactly the side I would pick Dean. Without question. Is there anyone not in side who could really argue they should be playing?? (Neville if fit, but he's not)

I also think that's the side the majority of people would pick, you always have people who hate certain players and over rate others, but I'd imagine 95% of poeple with any real football knowledge, who also watch the Premiership week in week out, would pick that side.

[Right Hand Man]

Pretty much agree with the side picked but there must be a case for Carrick in Hargreaves position.

I thought Hargreaves had a decent first half as did most of the team but I just feel Carrick uses the ball better than Hargreaves and I personally would give him the nod in the holding role on that basis

[Lord Zola]

http://wc2006.telegraph.co.uk/Document. ... 0C65DBFA00

Smith, seems to agree with my good self, as to why Beckham can coutn himself lucky to be in the side. A good read.

[Lord Zola]

Gerro in Becks bust-up
From THE SUN

DAVID BECKHAM and Steven Gerrard had a training ground bust-up before the Sweden draw.


Gerrard got annoyed as he felt England’s captain was hitting too many long balls during games.

Becks had a pop back and the pair had a frank exchange over tactics in front of the other squad members.

But England’s coaching staff are not overly concerned, viewing the clash as a healthy, spirited discussion between two of the country’s most senior players.

Their flare-up was quickly settled but demonstrated the underlying will to get tactics spot-on as Sven Goran Eriksson’s men continue to chase World Cup glory.

Liverpool star Gerrard’s anger was sparked by him wanting the ball played more through midfield.

And that is what happened as England came within a couple of minutes of beating their Group B rivals on Tuesday.

What with all the negativity around Beckahm, how many of you think his teammates think he is over rated. Think back to the Ireland game, when apparantly Rooney had a pop in the dressing room afterwards. Rumours were the Utd contingent of the squad were not happy the following week, pointing to his influence he has over Sven.

[Fingers]

Sven hasnt got the bottle to leave out Beckham, neither will McClaren. He will play every minute of every game unless he gets injured.

I think sides look at Beckham as strong point in our side and come up with a gameplan to nulify Beckhams impact on a game. This helps us as I think Beckham is our weakest Midfielder and the others are far more threatening than he is. Saying that his dead ball delivery in friendlies leading up to the world cup was excellent apart from the Paraguay game he's yet to hit a good one. In fairness in the last game against Sweden it was our defending at set pieces that was a problem we couldnt defend for toffee. I dont think JT will have as bad a game again in an England shirt.

[****]

I think sides look at Beckham as strong point in our side and come up with a gameplan to nulify Beckhams impact on a game. This helps us as I think Beckham is our weakest Midfielder and the others are far more threatening than he is.

This is exactly why every1 thinks beckham is our weakest midfielder. if the opposition had a gameplan to stop gerrard then we'd all be sayin gerrard is our weakest midfielder. personally id say gerrard is our strongest midfielder but beckham is close behind and because he is so good that is why teams focus on him. cole is reletively new to the england midfield only playing there over the last year or 2 and feel other teams didnt see him as a threat, thts y i think he has played so well so far. beckham was outstanding for real madrid this season. because teams concentrated on zidane. beckham is still good enough to play for england but yes ill agree he could be playing alot better. this is just my opinion anyways

[Lord Zola]

I think sides look at Beckham as strong point in our side and come up with a gameplan to nulify Beckhams impact on a game. This helps us as I think Beckham is our weakest Midfielder and the others are far more threatening than he is.

This is exactly why every1 thinks beckham is our weakest midfielder. if the opposition had a gameplan to stop gerrard then we'd all be sayin gerrard is our weakest midfielder. personally id say gerrard is our strongest midfielder but beckham is close behind and because he is so good that is why teams focus on him. cole is reletively new to the england midfield only playing there over the last year or 2 and feel other teams didnt see him as a threat, thts y i think he has played so well so far. beckham was outstanding for real madrid this season. because teams concentrated on zidane. beckham is still good enough to play for england but yes ill agree he could be playing alot better. this is just my opinion anyways

I think the posts form Fingers and CCUFC are laughable. Do you both honestly believe that teams set up against us purly to stop David Beckham playing football. That is absolute nonsense.

The trouble with Beckham, that he does nothing at pace anymore. When you see players like Gerrard, Cole & Rooney get the ball they always look to do something at pace, be it runing with the ball, or a quick passing exchange, but with Beckham his first instinct always seems to be to put his foot on it, and slow the game down. He just doesn't seem to have that verve or thrust that our other midfielders all have. All the sucessful teams play at pace, but through Beckham we don't. That's why we look so much more dangerous down the left flank, because both Ashley & Jo Cole play with pace in their game, which you don't have to be a quick player to do. Playing at the pace we do, teams (such as T&T) find us relatively easy to defend against.

[wrighty]

Pretty much agree with the side picked but there must be a case for Carrick in Hargreaves position.

I thought Hargreaves had a decent first half as did most of the team but I just feel Carrick uses the ball better than Hargreaves and I personally would give him the nod in the holding role on that basis

Going on their last game carrick was absolutley awful in the england b game distribution which i agree is normally a strong point was dreadful, my doubts with carrick are he does not drive forward when in posession of the ball, you do not often see him slotting a ball between defenders you do not see any real hunger or desire when making a tackle and lacks somewhat an idea of posistional sense when he's team is not in posession this will look like i am slaughtering him in fact i think he is a good player but in an anchor role with three in the middle makalele is the very best there is he does pass the ball as well as maybe carrick can but he is still very economical with the ball, something hargreaves was on tuesday against sweden he also showed some of the other qualities required to fulfill that role desire, drive and energy something the very nice mr carrick does not show enough of for the very top level sorry carrick fans i can hear the moans of disgust from the spurs fans already

[****]

I think sides look at Beckham as strong point in our side and come up with a gameplan to nulify Beckhams impact on a game. This helps us as I think Beckham is our weakest Midfielder and the others are far more threatening than he is.

This is exactly why every1 thinks beckham is our weakest midfielder. if the opposition had a gameplan to stop gerrard then we'd all be sayin gerrard is our weakest midfielder. personally id say gerrard is our strongest midfielder but beckham is close behind and because he is so good that is why teams focus on him. cole is reletively new to the england midfield only playing there over the last year or 2 and feel other teams didnt see him as a threat, thts y i think he has played so well so far. beckham was outstanding for real madrid this season. because teams concentrated on zidane. beckham is still good enough to play for england but yes ill agree he could be playing alot better. this is just my opinion anyways

I think the posts form Fingers and CCUFC are laughable.

and who scored the winning goal last night? who put in a good performance? who carried on playin for as long as possible right until the 80th odd minute whilst being sick on the pitch? BECKHAM thats why he should be playing!

[Lord Zola]

I think sides look at Beckham as strong point in our side and come up with a gameplan to nulify Beckhams impact on a game. This helps us as I think Beckham is our weakest Midfielder and the others are far more threatening than he is.

This is exactly why every1 thinks beckham is our weakest midfielder. if the opposition had a gameplan to stop gerrard then we'd all be sayin gerrard is our weakest midfielder. personally id say gerrard is our strongest midfielder but beckham is close behind and because he is so good that is why teams focus on him. cole is reletively new to the england midfield only playing there over the last year or 2 and feel other teams didnt see him as a threat, thts y i think he has played so well so far. beckham was outstanding for real madrid this season. because teams concentrated on zidane. beckham is still good enough to play for england but yes ill agree he could be playing alot better. this is just my opinion anyways

I think the posts form Fingers and CCUFC are laughable.

and who scored the winning goal last night? who put in a good performance? who carried on playin for as long as possible right until the 80th odd minute whilst being sick on the pitch? BECKHAM thats why he should be playing!

Thought he was poor to be honest, along with the other midfielders. Other than Joe Cole, I don't think are midfielders thus far have come out with any credit.

[Fingers]

Thought he was poor to be honest, along with the other midfielders. Other than Joe Cole, I don't think are midfielders thus far have come out with any credit.

Dont agree with Lord Zola - Steven Gerrard has scored 2 goals and Becks has scored 1 goal and set up 2. I agree Joe Cole is playing well. The only one not playing to his usual high standards in Frank Lampard, but I think its only a matter of time til he does. As has been proved thus far our midfielders have all won games for us, which all agreed on at that the start of tournament they can do. Add Rooney to the list who I thought was excellent leading the line yesterday, much better than Owen, and its looking good. They seem to do just enough in every game which is all we ask of them.

[Lord Zola]

Thought he was poor to be honest, along with the other midfielders. Other than Joe Cole, I don't think are midfielders thus far have come out with any credit.

Dont agree with Lord Zola - Steven Gerrard has scored 2 goals and Becks has scored 1 goal and set up 2. I agree Joe Cole is playing well. The only one not playing to his usual high standards in Frank Lampard, but I think its only a matter of time til he does. As has been proved thus far our midfielders have all won games for us, which all agreed on at that the start of tournament they can do. Add Rooney to the list who I thought was excellent leading the line yesterday, much better than Owen, and its looking good. They seem to do just enough in every game which is all we ask of them.

Despite their goals, I feel Beckham and Gerrards overall contribution has been poor. Can't think of a game where either of them were that good, can you?